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Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG
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Steady Eddie
Posted 2017-09-27 6:45 AM (#681130 - in reply to #681125)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG



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concust - 2017-09-27 8:26 AM


Graves was much better last night, his best game of the preseason. Not sure if it's too little too late, I don't see him getting a spot over either DeAngelo or Pionk at this point, and that's even assuming Holden gets moved. Not to say he couldn't be an NHL defenseman at this point but it's a numbers game.

Puempel hasn't really done anything to earn a roster spot. I'm guessing he's 13th F, if not then AHL.


Graves doesn't have the speed to be an NHL player. He got beat by Weise. Enough said. DeAngelo makes the team, Pionk does not.

Agree on Puempel. Carey is much better.
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concust
Posted 2017-09-27 6:48 AM (#681131 - in reply to #681128)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG



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robstones - 2017-09-27 7:37 AM

Those positional plays are hypothetically coachable.... there's room for improvement for DeAngelo if he stays within the system.




I don't disagree, at the same time, there's no point in hiring a dog and telling him how to bark. What I mean is, that aggressiveness on the puck is part of what makes Deangelo a talented offensive defenseman, if you coach too much out of him then he just becomes a mediocre two way defenseman. To a large degree you have to take the bad with the good.

I think the way you address that weakness is putting him with a complementary partner and ensuring that the forwards know they have to get back and help. There is often not enough of that. But that would entail AV to make the right personnel decisions, and we're talking about a coach who "loses track of his defensemen" in an elimination playoff game.
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concust
Posted 2017-09-27 6:50 AM (#681132 - in reply to #681130)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG



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Steady Eddie - 2017-09-27 7:45 AM

concust - 2017-09-27 8:26 AM


Graves was much better last night, his best game of the preseason. Not sure if it's too little too late, I don't see him getting a spot over either DeAngelo or Pionk at this point, and that's even assuming Holden gets moved. Not to say he couldn't be an NHL defenseman at this point but it's a numbers game.

Puempel hasn't really done anything to earn a roster spot. I'm guessing he's 13th F, if not then AHL.


Graves doesn't have the speed to be an NHL player. He got beat by Weise. Enough said. DeAngelo makes the team, Pionk does not.

Agree on Puempel. Carey is much better.


If Graves' positional play and anticipation get better, he can mask the lack of speed. Sauer did it. Beukeboom did it. He needs to play smarter if he can't play faster.
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scthockey2294
Posted 2017-09-27 7:09 AM (#681133 - in reply to #681132)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG



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concust - 2017-09-27 6:50 AM

Steady Eddie - 2017-09-27 7:45 AM

concust - 2017-09-27 8:26 AM


Graves was much better last night, his best game of the preseason. Not sure if it's too little too late, I don't see him getting a spot over either DeAngelo or Pionk at this point, and that's even assuming Holden gets moved. Not to say he couldn't be an NHL defenseman at this point but it's a numbers game.

Puempel hasn't really done anything to earn a roster spot. I'm guessing he's 13th F, if not then AHL.


Graves doesn't have the speed to be an NHL player. He got beat by Weise. Enough said. DeAngelo makes the team, Pionk does not.

Agree on Puempel. Carey is much better.


If Graves' positional play and anticipation get better, he can mask the lack of speed. Sauer did it. Beukeboom did it. He needs to play smarter if he can't play faster.


Graves will be an NHL defenseman halfway through this year or by training camp next year. Truly believe TD, Pionk & Graves can/will be on the Rangers by next year in full roles. However that likely means one of Mcdonaugh and Smith are gone. But maybe Graves next year makes Smith expendable.

I like smith a lot, but another year of improving by Graves and I think you have a similar/better player.

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itsmcilrathtime
Posted 2017-09-27 8:24 AM (#681134 - in reply to #681130)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG


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Steady Eddie - 2017-09-27 6:45 AM

concust - 2017-09-27 8:26 AM


Graves was much better last night, his best game of the preseason. Not sure if it's too little too late, I don't see him getting a spot over either DeAngelo or Pionk at this point, and that's even assuming Holden gets moved. Not to say he couldn't be an NHL defenseman at this point but it's a numbers game.

Puempel hasn't really done anything to earn a roster spot. I'm guessing he's 13th F, if not then AHL.


Graves doesn't have the speed to be an NHL player. He got beat by Weise. Enough said. DeAngelo makes the team, Pionk does not.

Agree on Puempel. Carey is much better.


You could not be a bigger moron on Graves. He skates better than half of the Penguins defense which has been a part of a team that won two cups in a row.

Edited by itsmcilrathtime 2017-09-27 8:25 AM
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robstones
Posted 2017-09-27 8:38 AM (#681135 - in reply to #681131)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG



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concust - 2017-09-27 8:48 AM

robstones - 2017-09-27 7:37 AM

Those positional plays are hypothetically coachable.... there's room for improvement for DeAngelo if he stays within the system.




I don't disagree, at the same time, there's no point in hiring a dog and telling him how to bark. What I mean is, that aggressiveness on the puck is part of what makes Deangelo a talented offensive defenseman, if you coach too much out of him then he just becomes a mediocre two way defenseman. To a large degree you have to take the bad with the good.

I think the way you address that weakness is putting him with a complementary partner and ensuring that the forwards know they have to get back and help. There is often not enough of that. But that would entail AV to make the right personnel decisions, and we're talking about a coach who "loses track of his defensemen" in an elimination playoff game.


I don't mean coach him to the point where he doesn't pinch.

I mean once he gets settled in, he'll be more part of the team.... the team is going to have to get use to Shattenkirk, too....

So, yeah having the right partner... having teammates know DeAngelo likes to pinch, so be ready for it.... Having DeAngelo know the system enough to know where his teammates are and make better decisions accordingly.

He has the better skillset.

If it were me, I'd have

McDonagh Shattenkirk
Skjei Pionk
Smith DeAngelo

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Rranger
Posted 2017-09-27 9:02 AM (#681136 - in reply to #681124)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG


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concust - 2017-09-27 5:18 AM

Rranger - 2017-09-26 6:47 PM

concust - 2017-09-26 4:42 PM

Rranger - 2017-09-26 6:32 PM

concust - 2017-09-26 4:31 PM

I'm not a big fan of Tony D but my god, he is a talented player.




Why not?


Not a big fan of defensemen who can't play defense, but, if he can add enough offense to make up for the defensive lapses, then fine by me.





Not arguing but I have to see more of him before I pin can't play defense on him. I haven't seen any big issues.


I've seen enough. Check out Philly's first goal at the end of the first period. Bad decision to pinch, because there's enough Flyers around and not enough support. He gets caught. Rangers are actually able to recover and have numbers back, but then he and the forward just lose a check and stand around while there's a Philly forward in front of the net and the goal is scored.

Not expecting him to be perfect but there's enough of those types of plays that it's a bit concern. I will say, on the flip side, if his pinch does work and keeps the puck in the zone, then maybe the Rangers can maintain possession and do something with it. And then there's nothing to criticize. But he's a young player and I think just needs to learn a bit when to take the risk and when not to. Like I said he's very good with the puck, skates well with it at speed, good vision. Has all the offensive tools, just needs to remember his responsibilities.






Here's how I see it. I see the pinch but DeAngelo is still third man back in the slot. I see a lot more problems than DeAngelo back. At the time the philly player carried the puck into the Ranger zone Kampfer had all day to pressure him, he did nothing allowing the Flyer to curl back a absolute no,no when you outnumber the opposition in your own zone. It was a one on three at that time. Rangers in good shape to defend if Kampfer gets off his ass. Terrible play on Kampfers part. While that's happening Voracek is entering the zone goes by DeAngelo and Carey who should have picked up Voracek and stayed with him as he was closest to Voracek and the net, and that's what forwards are supposed to do.. DeAngelo can see Morin steaming up the ice wide open while kampfer is allowing the Flyer puck carrier to curl. and Morin was only open because Desharnais for one decided to change and while doing so waddled back to the bench, giving Fontaine his change no chance to to get to Morin, and you can see Fontaine coming off the bench and trying to, but Desharnais dogged it off the ice and gave Fontaine no chance to get to Morin. If DeAngelo doesn't try to challenge Morin which he did forcing Morin to shoot he comes in another 10 feet. All the while a unscreened Pavlec didn't look real good on the shot. He should have identified Morin as the only option for the Flyer puck carrier and been at the top of the crease and waiting instead of deep in his crease and waiting. I don't place near the blame on DeAngelo as Kampfer, Desharnais and Pavlec all lazy. I've watched Desharnais in the past and get used to that. If he hustled off the ice, that goal and the shot doesn't happen because Fontaine gets on the ice in time to check Morin. Deangelo couldn't have done much other than what he did.
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Steady Eddie
Posted 2017-09-27 9:11 AM (#681139 - in reply to #681134)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG



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itsmcilrathtime - 2017-09-27 10:24 AM

Steady Eddie - 2017-09-27 6:45 AM

concust - 2017-09-27 8:26 AM


Graves was much better last night, his best game of the preseason. Not sure if it's too little too late, I don't see him getting a spot over either DeAngelo or Pionk at this point, and that's even assuming Holden gets moved. Not to say he couldn't be an NHL defenseman at this point but it's a numbers game.

Puempel hasn't really done anything to earn a roster spot. I'm guessing he's 13th F, if not then AHL.


Graves doesn't have the speed to be an NHL player. He got beat by Weise. Enough said. DeAngelo makes the team, Pionk does not.

Agree on Puempel. Carey is much better.


You could not be a bigger moron on Graves. He skates better than half of the Penguins defense which has been a part of a team that won two cups in a row.


He skates as well as McIlrath, and where is he now? Who's the moron? You are the board dunce? You make Believeme look like a genius. Why so much love for AAAA players?

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itsmcilrathtime
Posted 2017-09-27 9:32 AM (#681140 - in reply to #680947)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG


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McIlrath doesn't have an ounce of the offense to his game that Graves does. AV ruined McIlrath because he loves small clowns that don't clear the crease. Also, Girardi and Staal have been skating slower than McIlrath for the past 4 years. You obviously don't realize we have a closed minded coach that is not willing to change his thinking. Renney didn't. He got fired. Torts wouldn't. He got fired. AV won't and most likely, he will be fired at the end of this year.

Edited by itsmcilrathtime 2017-09-27 9:33 AM
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sureshore
Posted 2017-09-27 12:00 PM (#681144 - in reply to #681140)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG


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itsmcilrathtime - 2017-09-27 11:32 AM

we have a closed minded coach that is not willing to change his thinking. Renney didn't. He got fired. Torts wouldn't. He got fired. AV won't and most likely, he will be fired at the end of this year.


Pretty much every coach eventually gets fired. Only the best of the best call their shots on when they go
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concust
Posted 2017-09-27 7:53 PM (#681148 - in reply to #681140)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG



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itsmcilrathtime - 2017-09-27 10:32 AM

McIlrath doesn't have an ounce of the offense to his game that Graves does. AV ruined McIlrath because he loves small clowns that don't clear the crease. Also, Girardi and Staal have been skating slower than McIlrath for the past 4 years. You obviously don't realize we have a closed minded coach that is not willing to change his thinking. Renney didn't. He got fired. Torts wouldn't. He got fired. AV won't and most likely, he will be fired at the end of this year.


Talk about the AHL hardest shot again, I need that square for my bingo board.

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Vua
Posted 2017-09-27 8:25 PM (#681149 - in reply to #681148)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG


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concust - 2017-09-27 7:53 PM

itsmcilrathtime - 2017-09-27 10:32 AM

McIlrath doesn't have an ounce of the offense to his game that Graves does. AV ruined McIlrath because he loves small clowns that don't clear the crease. Also, Girardi and Staal have been skating slower than McIlrath for the past 4 years. You obviously don't realize we have a closed minded coach that is not willing to change his thinking. Renney didn't. He got fired. Torts wouldn't. He got fired. AV won't and most likely, he will be fired at the end of this year.


Talk about the AHL hardest shot again, I need that square for my bingo board.



I'm pretty sure we all get that spot on our boards. Dan Girardi had slightly better offensive AHL stats in less games. Can't wait for his 15 point per season explosions. God I gate that he makes we want to rag on our own prospects but he won't make the NHL on his offense. Tell me about his size, his positioning or his toughness, but stop equating offensive ability to a shot.



Edited by Vua 2017-09-27 8:29 PM
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itsmcilrathtime
Posted 2017-09-28 2:25 AM (#681150 - in reply to #680947)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG


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Never ceases to amaze me how the fans of this team continue to blindly believe in every coach we have as if they never make mistakes. Howe quickly our fans forget the complete incompetence of AV with his selections of personnel in the last minute of games vs the Sens in the playoffs. Also, it is as if you watched the games with your eyes closed in the pre-season. Graves out of the zone passing was fantastic. He hit Fontaine for a breakaway on one long pass. Setup a couple of odd man rushes with other passes. However, like most our fans, you continue to want small defenseman who lose every puck battle in the corners like AV. Actually take a look at the defenseman on the Penguins last year. You might learn something about hockey. Ian Cole, 6'1, 220 and almost no offensive ability. Hainsey, 6'3, 210, a relic and no offensive ability. Maata, 6'2, 210 and very little offensive ability. Dumolin, 6'4 and little offensive ability. These were 4 of the defenseman playing 25 games in the playoffs for the Penguins.

I swear, you tools have been brainwashed by AV to think that you need 4 puck moving defenseman to win a cup. Essentially, the Penguins had 1 offensive defenseman last year in the playoffs. Schultz and he was a guy that couldn't play defense. The Penguins despite Crosby, Malkin and Kessel won two cups because their defensive defenseman and role players didn't allow goals in the biggest games. Something out thickhead head coach can't grasp.

Edited by itsmcilrathtime 2017-09-28 2:26 AM
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Vua
Posted 2017-09-28 6:12 AM (#681155 - in reply to #680947)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG


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I can't think of anyone here other than maybe Rob likes AV as the coach. But while he is here, he's going to select the players that fit his terrible defensive system best. Well except for grizzled overpaid veterans that can't play anymore. They get spots automatically because AV is a dumbass. I have absolutely nothing against Graves. He just doesn't strike me as an offensive player. That doesn't mean he can't move the puck well enough though. None of us like having a bunch of defensemen that can't or aren't allowed to clear the crease. That is who our coach currently is though and you have to face that reality.

You are the one that comes off as a tool in every post you make. Regardless of what you think, presentation matters and you suck at it. If you didn't claim all knowing knowledge about prospects and call everyone idiots and dumbasses in every post, they might actually consider your opinion. But you can't and so we won't. It's more entertaining to take you to task for being such a douche than trying to have an actual conversation with you because you can't go more than 1 post without proclaiming yourself a genius and everyone else a bunch of morons.

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robstones
Posted 2017-09-28 7:21 AM (#681159 - in reply to #680947)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG



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We've had pretty good success with AV... maybe that's coincidental because of players on the team, too.... but the success has been there...

I hated just about everyone before Torts, who..... most people here hated Tortorella oddly enough...

I just don't blame everything on the guy. Nash, Kreider and Hayes were never ever big nasty Milan Lucic power forwards..... and because they don't play like that, it's AV's fault? That's a bit of a stretch for me.

The guy got a bad rep for being a pansy when he commented about fighting.... he doesn't think fights are an important part of the game.... ever since then it's all his fault that Staal doesn't clear the crease.

My question has always been, if not AV, then who? Who is the better option? Lindy Ruff? Mark Messier? Who?
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concust
Posted 2017-09-28 7:39 AM (#681161 - in reply to #681159)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG



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robstones - 2017-09-28 8:21 AM

We've had pretty good success with AV... maybe that's coincidental because of players on the team, too.... but the success has been there...

I hated just about everyone before Torts, who..... most people here hated Tortorella oddly enough...

I just don't blame everything on the guy. Nash, Kreider and Hayes were never ever big nasty Milan Lucic power forwards..... and because they don't play like that, it's AV's fault? That's a bit of a stretch for me.

The guy got a bad rep for being a pansy when he commented about fighting.... he doesn't think fights are an important part of the game.... ever since then it's all his fault that Staal doesn't clear the crease.

My question has always been, if not AV, then who? Who is the better option? Lindy Ruff? Mark Messier? Who?


I was pretty indifferent about AV, up to a point. Coach doesn't score any goals, coach doesn't stop any pucks. Those are important things that win and lose games. What coach does (or is supposed to do) is to maximize the roster. That means given a set of players, you put together and manage a team that will work at its most efficient. Maximize strengths by pairing players together who complement each other. Minimize weakness by, pairing players together who complement each other. In the end, given the same roster, a great NHL coach vs an average NHL coach, might squeeze out an extra win or two over the course of a season. This is an extreme, best case scenario.

The point that I referenced, was late in the series last year where he openly admitted he basically lost track of who was on the bench and available, and who was not. This led to situations like putting Tanner Glass on the ice with 2:00 to play. Or keeping Skjei and Smith on the bench, fresh, while Staal and Holden were out there. Every coach plays favorites and AV is no different. However in a playoff game, in an elimination game no less, failure to adapt is a failure to do the most basic part of your job. That to me was the final straw. It's the one mistake you can't make, because it's the one thing that is your job. Everything else is secondary.

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concust
Posted 2017-09-28 7:46 AM (#681162 - in reply to #681159)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG



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robstones - 2017-09-28 8:21 AM

My question has always been, if not AV, then who? Who is the better option? Lindy Ruff? Mark Messier? Who?


I don't have a good answer for this. Ruff is not a better option he's just a different option. He's made it past the first round of the playoffs once in the past 10 years. In his 19 year coaching career, he's made the playoffs 10 times and missed 9 times. He's been to one SC Final, 18 years ago. I don't know why anyone would think he could come in, replace AV and sprinkle his magic coaching dust and make things better. Messier is an authoritarian, and we had that with Torts. Having said that he hasn't yet proven that he can't coach a team, so he has that at least.

There's not a lot of great options out there IMO.
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Vua
Posted 2017-09-28 8:02 AM (#681165 - in reply to #681159)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG


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robstones - 2017-09-28 7:21 AM

We've had pretty good success with AV... maybe that's coincidental because of players on the team, too.... but the success has been there...

I hated just about everyone before Torts, who..... most people here hated Tortorella oddly enough...

I just don't blame everything on the guy. Nash, Kreider and Hayes were never ever big nasty Milan Lucic power forwards..... and because they don't play like that, it's AV's fault? That's a bit of a stretch for me.

The guy got a bad rep for being a pansy when he commented about fighting.... he doesn't think fights are an important part of the game.... ever since then it's all his fault that Staal doesn't clear the crease.

My question has always been, if not AV, then who? Who is the better option? Lindy Ruff? Mark Messier? Who?


I didn't care for him before he got here. I thought you liked him as a coach but honestly couldn't remember in the moment. I have no issue with someone liking a coach. I like Torts. Always have. I realize he wears out his welcome but I think he's the perfect guy for a young team. You can like AV. It doesn't make you an idiot regardless of what someone here would tell you.
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robstones
Posted 2017-09-28 8:06 AM (#681166 - in reply to #681162)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG



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concust - 2017-09-28 9:46 AM

robstones - 2017-09-28 8:21 AM

My question has always been, if not AV, then who? Who is the better option? Lindy Ruff? Mark Messier? Who?


I don't have a good answer for this. Ruff is not a better option he's just a different option. He's made it past the first round of the playoffs once in the past 10 years. In his 19 year coaching career, he's made the playoffs 10 times and missed 9 times. He's been to one SC Final, 18 years ago. I don't know why anyone would think he could come in, replace AV and sprinkle his magic coaching dust and make things better. Messier is an authoritarian, and we had that with Torts. Having said that he hasn't yet proven that he can't coach a team, so he has that at least.

There's not a lot of great options out there IMO.


Exactly. AV suddenly isn't so bad when you look at your options. I would like Darryl Sutter if he's still available.... but after that, it's pretty slim pickens.

I like AV more than I like Trottier
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concust
Posted 2017-09-28 11:25 AM (#681191 - in reply to #681166)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG



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robstones - 2017-09-28 9:06 AM

concust - 2017-09-28 9:46 AM

robstones - 2017-09-28 8:21 AM

My question has always been, if not AV, then who? Who is the better option? Lindy Ruff? Mark Messier? Who?


I don't have a good answer for this. Ruff is not a better option he's just a different option. He's made it past the first round of the playoffs once in the past 10 years. In his 19 year coaching career, he's made the playoffs 10 times and missed 9 times. He's been to one SC Final, 18 years ago. I don't know why anyone would think he could come in, replace AV and sprinkle his magic coaching dust and make things better. Messier is an authoritarian, and we had that with Torts. Having said that he hasn't yet proven that he can't coach a team, so he has that at least.

There's not a lot of great options out there IMO.


Exactly. AV suddenly isn't so bad when you look at your options. I would like Darryl Sutter if he's still available.... but after that, it's pretty slim pickens.

I like AV more than I like Trottier


I didn't mean my post to sound like we should keep AV either... I don't think he'll torpedo the team but I do think he's unable to take the team to the next level, true contention. We saw it in 2014 Finals - unable to adjust to the competition. The same thing eliminated us vs Ottawa - unable to adjust to the game situation. AV is a great regular season coach whose success often bleeds into the playoffs but that's where it ends.

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Mikey Red
Posted 2017-09-28 11:28 AM (#681193 - in reply to #680947)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG



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AV sucks....He forgets who's on the bench and plays favorites...F him
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Rranger
Posted 2017-09-28 3:42 PM (#681217 - in reply to #680947)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG


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I'm in the woods so spotty internet other than desjardin still there no big surprises, nice for Carey. I'm not seeing news about Fontaine.

Edited by Rranger 2017-09-28 3:43 PM
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robstones
Posted 2017-09-28 4:58 PM (#681223 - in reply to #681217)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG



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Rranger - 2017-09-28 5:42 PM

I'm in the woods so spotty internet other than desjardin still there no big surprises, nice for Carey. I'm not seeing news about Fontaine.


Fontaine was cut the other day
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Rranger
Posted 2017-09-28 6:51 PM (#681230 - in reply to #681223)
Subject: Re: Preseason Game 6: New York Rangers at Philadelphia Flyers - 9/26/17 - 7pm MSG


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robstones - 2017-09-28 3:58 PM

Rranger - 2017-09-28 5:42 PM

I'm in the woods so spotty internet other than desjardin still there no big surprises, nice for Carey. I'm not seeing news about Fontaine.


Fontaine was cut the other day






ThanksRob.
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