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Game 16: Columbus Blue Jackets @ New York Rangers 11/6/17 - 7pm - MSG
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Mjolnir
Posted 2017-11-08 3:01 PM (#686985 - in reply to #686978)
Subject: Re: Game 16: Columbus Blue Jackets @ New York Rangers 11/6/17 - 7pm - MSG



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Rranger - 2017-11-08 4:12 PM

robstones - 2017-11-08 12:36 PM

Smith came in to camp out of shape.... reportedly....

He could be sitting out until he works off his Summer beer and pizza gut, is my guess.

He'll be back in the lineup when he gets in shape, and should play better because of it.

Because I will argue that he was good in the playoffs, and adds a needed edge back there... call it sand paper if you want...



It is stretch to suggest after 16 games, exhibition season and training camp Smith is still out of shape, and he is being whipped into shape as he sits out the last few games. Its ridiculous.
I've mentioned he was good against Montreal not so good against Ottawa in last seasons playoffs. He's inconsistent.
Smiths play has put him where he is. Others playing ahead of him may or may not have the raw ability to be better than him or might not. But in double mints view they are playing better and getting wins. Wins they desperately need. Its not like the players have a high bar to be better than Smith. Double mint is probably the only coach dumb enough to break up a winning lineup for a sideways lineup change. Its a marathon not a sprint, when your winning its status quo. Its not like he is guaranteed to come in and outplay anyone in the lineup now. He will get his chance to redeem himself, and he better be ready.


One has to wonder how much AV's (so-called) coaching has played a part in this...after all, we know AV does not put his players in situations where they can succeed.
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Vua
Posted 2017-11-08 4:27 PM (#686989 - in reply to #686985)
Subject: Re: Game 16: Columbus Blue Jackets @ New York Rangers 11/6/17 - 7pm - MSG


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Mjolnir - 2017-11-08 3:01 PM

Rranger - 2017-11-08 4:12 PM

robstones - 2017-11-08 12:36 PM

Smith came in to camp out of shape.... reportedly....

He could be sitting out until he works off his Summer beer and pizza gut, is my guess.

He'll be back in the lineup when he gets in shape, and should play better because of it.

Because I will argue that he was good in the playoffs, and adds a needed edge back there... call it sand paper if you want...



It is stretch to suggest after 16 games, exhibition season and training camp Smith is still out of shape, and he is being whipped into shape as he sits out the last few games. Its ridiculous.
I've mentioned he was good against Montreal not so good against Ottawa in last seasons playoffs. He's inconsistent.
Smiths play has put him where he is. Others playing ahead of him may or may not have the raw ability to be better than him or might not. But in double mints view they are playing better and getting wins. Wins they desperately need. Its not like the players have a high bar to be better than Smith. Double mint is probably the only coach dumb enough to break up a winning lineup for a sideways lineup change. Its a marathon not a sprint, when your winning its status quo. Its not like he is guaranteed to come in and outplay anyone in the lineup now. He will get his chance to redeem himself, and he better be ready.


One has to wonder how much AV's (so-called) coaching has played a part in this...after all, we know AV does not put his players in situations where they can succeed.


Sure he does. I mean Holden got the most even strength minutes if any defenseman last game.
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Rranger
Posted 2017-11-08 4:31 PM (#686990 - in reply to #686985)
Subject: Re: Game 16: Columbus Blue Jackets @ New York Rangers 11/6/17 - 7pm - MSG


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Mjolnir - 2017-11-08 2:01 PM

Rranger - 2017-11-08 4:12 PM

robstones - 2017-11-08 12:36 PM

Smith came in to camp out of shape.... reportedly....

He could be sitting out until he works off his Summer beer and pizza gut, is my guess.

He'll be back in the lineup when he gets in shape, and should play better because of it.

Because I will argue that he was good in the playoffs, and adds a needed edge back there... call it sand paper if you want...



It is stretch to suggest after 16 games, exhibition season and training camp Smith is still out of shape, and he is being whipped into shape as he sits out the last few games. Its ridiculous.
I've mentioned he was good against Montreal not so good against Ottawa in last seasons playoffs. He's inconsistent.
Smiths play has put him where he is. Others playing ahead of him may or may not have the raw ability to be better than him or might not. But in double mints view they are playing better and getting wins. Wins they desperately need. Its not like the players have a high bar to be better than Smith. Double mint is probably the only coach dumb enough to break up a winning lineup for a sideways lineup change. Its a marathon not a sprint, when your winning its status quo. Its not like he is guaranteed to come in and outplay anyone in the lineup now. He will get his chance to redeem himself, and he better be ready.


One has to wonder how much AV's (so-called) coaching has played a part in this...after all, we know AV does not put his players in situations where they can succeed.



I tweaked my post before I saw you quoted it, oh well. I mentioned earlier it didn’t help playing Smitty with McD basically as a shutdown pair, and agree with you that doesn’t help his cause. His game just isn’t at that level. There Is a storm brewing over his salary and use, and Gorton’s going to have some questions to answer justifying his salary for a third pair guy. He’s not beating Skjei, McD, Shattenkirk, for top two pair. The opening is there for the fourth hole but he’s got it to do.
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Rranger
Posted 2017-11-08 4:54 PM (#686992 - in reply to #686989)
Subject: Re: Game 16: Columbus Blue Jackets @ New York Rangers 11/6/17 - 7pm - MSG


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Vua - 2017-11-08 3:27 PM

Mjolnir - 2017-11-08 3:01 PM

Rranger - 2017-11-08 4:12 PM

robstones - 2017-11-08 12:36 PM

Smith came in to camp out of shape.... reportedly....

He could be sitting out until he works off his Summer beer and pizza gut, is my guess.

He'll be back in the lineup when he gets in shape, and should play better because of it.

Because I will argue that he was good in the playoffs, and adds a needed edge back there... call it sand paper if you want...



It is stretch to suggest after 16 games, exhibition season and training camp Smith is still out of shape, and he is being whipped into shape as he sits out the last few games. Its ridiculous.
I've mentioned he was good against Montreal not so good against Ottawa in last seasons playoffs. He's inconsistent.
Smiths play has put him where he is. Others playing ahead of him may or may not have the raw ability to be better than him or might not. But in double mints view they are playing better and getting wins. Wins they desperately need. Its not like the players have a high bar to be better than Smith. Double mint is probably the only coach dumb enough to break up a winning lineup for a sideways lineup change. Its a marathon not a sprint, when your winning its status quo. Its not like he is guaranteed to come in and outplay anyone in the lineup now. He will get his chance to redeem himself, and he better be ready.


One has to wonder how much AV's (so-called) coaching has played a part in this...after all, we know AV does not put his players in situations where they can succeed.


Sure he does. I mean Holden got the most even strength minutes if any defenseman last game.


That much ice time for Holden is a set up for success, or that much ice time is a setup for failure.
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concust
Posted 2017-11-09 6:52 AM (#687228 - in reply to #686975)
Subject: Re: Game 16: Columbus Blue Jackets @ New York Rangers 11/6/17 - 7pm - MSG



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Rranger - 2017-11-08 12:09 PM

Kampfer has not been glaringly bad like Smith who when he’s bad, he takes it to quite a level. . When Smiths good he’s just a third pair guy, just like Kampfer who is a barely adequate third pair guy. The fact the bonehead coach puts Smith with McD is more of a reflection of his coaching abilities than keeping a winning lineup together. And it’s not lazy or dumb coaching to keep a guy who was as bad as Smith out of the lineup while they are winning. It would look far dumber if he put Smith back in and he had one of his nights and the Rangers lost.
Smith is to expensive in a cap world for his role. As long as Smith is back there he is one thought away from a blunder. He is just not a Smart hockey player. Smith has been inconsistent his entire career, and has shown that over and over. If I had my druthers I’d like to see Graves who was quietly steady during training camp given a chance to put his solid defensive game to the test.


We disagree on this I guess. Smith being bad was in games the Rangers didn't score and subsequently lost, so I think the optics make his mistakes more glaring. Kampfer, and to a lesser degree, Holden, have similarly missed assignments, given the puck away, and committed many of the same errors, but the rangers are 7-2 in their last 9 so their mistakes don't cost games and so they're overlooked.

Having watched these three guys play a significant number of games I can't say that a punishment-benching of a veteran who you just signed, is justifiable in this case. If Smith or anyone else plays like crap, sure bench him for a game or two. At this point though, it just seems punitive.
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concust
Posted 2017-11-09 6:54 AM (#687229 - in reply to #686990)
Subject: Re: Game 16: Columbus Blue Jackets @ New York Rangers 11/6/17 - 7pm - MSG



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Location: USA
Rranger - 2017-11-08 5:31 PM


I tweaked my post before I saw you quoted it, oh well. I mentioned earlier it didn’t help playing Smitty with McD basically as a shutdown pair, and agree with you that doesn’t help his cause. His game just isn’t at that level. There Is a storm brewing over his salary and use, and Gorton’s going to have some questions to answer justifying his salary for a third pair guy. He’s not beating Skjei, McD, Shattenkirk, for top two pair. The opening is there for the fourth hole but he’s got it to do.


I agree, but he can't do it from the bench. Kampfer is a career AHL journeyman, if Smith can't get his act together and play better than Kampfer... that is either a serious problem for AV, or Gorton, or both. But I think we all know the dysfunction between the coach and GM at this point.
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Mjolnir
Posted 2017-11-09 8:21 AM (#687231 - in reply to #687228)
Subject: Re: Game 16: Columbus Blue Jackets @ New York Rangers 11/6/17 - 7pm - MSG



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concust - 2017-11-09 8:52 AM

Having watched these three guys play a significant number of games I can't say that a punishment-benching of a veteran who you just signed, is justifiable in this case. If Smith or anyone else plays like crap, sure bench him for a game or two. At this point though, it just seems punitive.


Let's not forget that Smith is not the prototypical D-man ....it seems to me that Smith needs to play with an edge to be effective...a HUGE no-no if you're playing for AV. As maligned as he is, much the same can be said for Holden. If you remember the beginning of last season, Holden was playing with an edge, hitting and body checking any opposing player within reach (without taking stupid penalties). AV soon cured him of that and we saw the results.

Edited by Mjolnir 2017-11-09 8:24 AM
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Rranger
Posted 2017-11-09 8:01 PM (#687247 - in reply to #687228)
Subject: Re: Game 16: Columbus Blue Jackets @ New York Rangers 11/6/17 - 7pm - MSG


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concust - 2017-11-09 5:52 AM

Rranger - 2017-11-08 12:09 PM

Kampfer has not been glaringly bad like Smith who when he’s bad, he takes it to quite a level. . When Smiths good he’s just a third pair guy, just like Kampfer who is a barely adequate third pair guy. The fact the bonehead coach puts Smith with McD is more of a reflection of his coaching abilities than keeping a winning lineup together. And it’s not lazy or dumb coaching to keep a guy who was as bad as Smith out of the lineup while they are winning. It would look far dumber if he put Smith back in and he had one of his nights and the Rangers lost.
Smith is to expensive in a cap world for his role. As long as Smith is back there he is one thought away from a blunder. He is just not a Smart hockey player. Smith has been inconsistent his entire career, and has shown that over and over. If I had my druthers I’d like to see Graves who was quietly steady during training camp given a chance to put his solid defensive game to the test.


We disagree on this I guess. Smith being bad was in games the Rangers didn't score and subsequently lost, so I think the optics make his mistakes more glaring. Kampfer, and to a lesser degree, Holden, have similarly missed assignments, given the puck away, and committed many of the same errors, but the rangers are 7-2 in their last 9 so their mistakes don't cost games and so they're overlooked.

Having watched these three guys play a significant number of games I can't say that a punishment-benching of a veteran who you just signed, is justifiable in this case. If Smith or anyone else plays like crap, sure bench him for a game or two. At this point though, it just seems punitive.





It’s more a case we are both right, just at different points in the schedule. I would expect at some point Smith will get back in the lineup and outplay Kampfer, or Holden. Get his spot back and be good for who knows how long. He will hit a stretch where he is not good and possibly benched again. That’s how it works, you know that I know that. Smith is not a player worthy of his salary, that’s not his fault but he’s going to be carrying that stigma.
I watched Kampfer real close last night and he was basically mistake free, he had a real solid game. He gave Double mint no reason whatsoever to sit him next game and I’d be shocked if he did. But journeymen being inconsistent, he will have his bobble and in will go Smith. I don’t see Smith sitting as punitive or anything, I just see them sticking to the winning lineup. Kampfer has to play every game like last night to stick, he won’t thats why he is a bubble guy. Consistency is one of the biggest factors separating guys who play all the time and guys who don’t. Smith and Kampfer have to overcome inconsistency to stick in a lineup, they both play well enough when they have their game going and both deserve to sit when their game is not going.



Edited by Rranger 2017-11-09 10:29 PM
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