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For arguments sake: Whose numbers are retired if we didn't win 94 Cup?
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concust
Posted 2019-01-14 9:18 AM (#718179)
Subject: For arguments sake: Whose numbers are retired if we didn't win 94 Cup?



Legend

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As it stands, Rangers have numbers retired:

1, Giacomin
2, Leetch
3, Howell
7, Gilbert
9, Bathgate, Graves
11, Hadfield, Messier
19, Ratelle
35, Richter

For arguments sake, let's say Vancouver wins Game 7, 3-2. History otherwise plays out the same. Does this list look the same?

I think Leetch is a given regardless, but of the other 3 from the Cup team, who would stay and who would go?
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robstones
Posted 2019-01-14 10:05 AM (#718180 - in reply to #718179)
Subject: Re: For arguments sake: Whose numbers are retired if we didn't win 94 Cup?



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Richter broke every Giacomin record.... he'd be up there, and Lundqvist will be up there too for the same reason

The top 5 for goals scored is

Gilbert
Ratelle
Graves
Bathgate
Hadfield

So Gravey makes a solid case for himself. I'm not sure Mess makes it, though.
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Mikey Red
Posted 2019-01-14 10:34 AM (#718182 - in reply to #718179)
Subject: Re: For arguments sake: Whose numbers are retired if we didn't win 94 Cup?


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Mess dont belong up there.....Graves MAYBE ......and they sure as hell shouldnt be up there then make Bathgate, Howell, Ratelle and Hadfield wait 40 year to get theirs. Organization doesnt have a clue. I believe the honor should be for either homegrown players or those who come very early in their careers here. Richter, Leetch automatics
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robstones
Posted 2019-01-14 10:40 AM (#718184 - in reply to #718179)
Subject: Re: For arguments sake: Whose numbers are retired if we didn't win 94 Cup?



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The only reason Messier is there is because he brought a Cup to New York.... but that's a pretty damn good reason.... He belongs
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Mikey Red
Posted 2019-01-14 10:44 AM (#718185 - in reply to #718179)
Subject: Re: For arguments sake: Whose numbers are retired if we didn't win 94 Cup?


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Richter is the reason we made it to...and won the Finals
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Mikey Red
Posted 2019-01-14 10:47 AM (#718186 - in reply to #718179)
Subject: Re: For arguments sake: Whose numbers are retired if we didn't win 94 Cup?


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G6 vs the Devils is 5-0 in the first period if not for Richter. Kovalev got us back in the game then Mess scored 3 weak goals in the 3rd. I thank God it happened that way but Richter is the Ranger God
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robstones
Posted 2019-01-14 10:49 AM (#718187 - in reply to #718185)
Subject: Re: For arguments sake: Whose numbers are retired if we didn't win 94 Cup?



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Mikey Red - 2019-01-14 12:44 PM

Richter is the reason we made it to...and won the Finals


The team as a whole was great. Leetch was the MVP... But if Messier wasn't there, they don't win... Kelly Kisio wouldn'tve captained the team to a Cup
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Mikey Red
Posted 2019-01-14 10:53 AM (#718188 - in reply to #718187)
Subject: Re: For arguments sake: Whose numbers are retired if we didn't win 94 Cup?


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robstones - 2019-01-14 12:49 PM

Mikey Red - 2019-01-14 12:44 PM

Richter is the reason we made it to...and won the Finals


The team as a whole was great. Leetch was the MVP... But if Messier wasn't there, they don't win... Kelly Kisio wouldn'tve captained the team to a Cup

hahaha yep but come on dude....Richter was all world back then
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concust
Posted 2019-01-14 11:03 AM (#718189 - in reply to #718185)
Subject: Re: For arguments sake: Whose numbers are retired if we didn't win 94 Cup?



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Mikey Red - 2019-01-14 11:44 AM

Richter is the reason we made it to...and won the Finals


Yeah I'm with you but I'm just asking if Richter never won a Cup does he still get it. I think you can argue it either way. He's pretty clearly among the top for Rangers goalies with Giacomin, and Lundqvist, but then you realize when compared to the rest of the league of the same era, he wasn't dominant. He was probably a top 10 goalie when he played, but much closer to 10 than 1. (looking at saves, svpct, GAA, shutouts among his peers)

Graves had longevity and goal scoring, but as much as I love him I think he's borderline.

Messier, who I initially wanted to say no to, is top 5 in NYR points scored behind Gilbert, Leetch, Ratelle, Bathgate. And just ahead of Tkaczuk and Gresch.
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robstones
Posted 2019-01-14 11:08 AM (#718190 - in reply to #718188)
Subject: Re: For arguments sake: Whose numbers are retired if we didn't win 94 Cup?



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Mikey Red - 2019-01-14 12:53 PM

robstones - 2019-01-14 12:49 PM

Mikey Red - 2019-01-14 12:44 PM

Richter is the reason we made it to...and won the Finals


The team as a whole was great. Leetch was the MVP... But if Messier wasn't there, they don't win... Kelly Kisio wouldn'tve captained the team to a Cup

hahaha yep but come on dude....Richter was all world back then


Of course he was. You can replace some guys on the team, and still win The Cup.... Messier isn't one of them... certainly not Ritcher, Graves, or Leetch either.... There's just no denying Messier's impact. They don't win The Cup without him, and frankly the team was built around him. It was Messier's team. He was the face of the team, and formed their identity... for a long time.

He was a Ranger for 10 seasons.... 6 of them were really good ones
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robstones
Posted 2019-01-14 11:13 AM (#718191 - in reply to #718189)
Subject: Re: For arguments sake: Whose numbers are retired if we didn't win 94 Cup?



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concust - 2019-01-14 1:03 PM

Mikey Red - 2019-01-14 11:44 AM

Richter is the reason we made it to...and won the Finals


Yeah I'm with you but I'm just asking if Richter never won a Cup does he still get it. I think you can argue it either way. He's pretty clearly among the top for Rangers goalies with Giacomin, and Lundqvist, but then you realize when compared to the rest of the league of the same era, he wasn't dominant. He was probably a top 10 goalie when he played, but much closer to 10 than 1. (looking at saves, svpct, GAA, shutouts among his peers)

Graves had longevity and goal scoring, but as much as I love him I think he's borderline.

Messier, who I initially wanted to say no to, is top 5 in NYR points scored behind Gilbert, Leetch, Ratelle, Bathgate. And just ahead of Tkaczuk and Gresch.


It doesn't have anything to do with the rest of the league. It's about Rangers.

Ritcher was an allstar regardless, though. USA starter for his entire international career, too... if we want to talk about all time... He's an all time great and hall of famer with or without a Cup
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Mikey Red
Posted 2019-01-14 11:16 AM (#718192 - in reply to #718189)
Subject: Re: For arguments sake: Whose numbers are retired if we didn't win 94 Cup?


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concust - 2019-01-14 1:03 PM

Mikey Red - 2019-01-14 11:44 AM

Richter is the reason we made it to...and won the Finals


Yeah I'm with you but I'm just asking if Richter never won a Cup does he still get it. I think you can argue it either way. He's pretty clearly among the top for Rangers goalies with Giacomin, and Lundqvist, but then you realize when compared to the rest of the league of the same era, he wasn't dominant. He was probably a top 10 goalie when he played, but much closer to 10 than 1. (looking at saves, svpct, GAA, shutouts among his peers)

Graves had longevity and goal scoring, but as much as I love him I think he's borderline.

Messier, who I initially wanted to say no to, is top 5 in NYR points scored behind Gilbert, Leetch, Ratelle, Bathgate. And just ahead of Tkaczuk and Gresch.

Richter is a tricky situation.....He won the Cup for us and he won the 96 WCOH single handedly. But after 97 they put an AHL team out there in front of him. So if he doesnt win the Cup you prob can make the anti argument
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Rangerjunkie
Posted 2019-01-14 12:51 PM (#718196 - in reply to #718184)
Subject: Re: For arguments sake: Whose numbers are retired if we didn't win 94 Cup?


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robstones - 2019-01-14 10:40 AM

The only reason Messier is there is because he brought a Cup to New York.... but that's a pretty damn good reason.... He belongs


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concust
Posted 2019-01-14 2:10 PM (#718202 - in reply to #718196)
Subject: Re: For arguments sake: Whose numbers are retired if we didn't win 94 Cup?



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Location: USA
Rangerjunkie - 2019-01-14 1:51 PM

robstones - 2019-01-14 10:40 AM

The only reason Messier is there is because he brought a Cup to New York.... but that's a pretty damn good reason.... He belongs




Even if he doesn't though, he's fifth all time in Rangers points... that's worth something by itself right?
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