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Lias Andersson Requests Trade
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Vua
Posted 2020-01-10 4:49 PM (#731009 - in reply to #731006)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade


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itsmcilrathtime - 2020-01-10 12:11 PM

It's incredible that two loser posters Vua and Concust continue for 20 fukking years to never to blame any Rangers coach for anything. Always the players fault. Never the coach. The same coaches that always end up winning nothing and getting fired here. There is no doubt that both of you date you hand every day. That's what happens when you are life long dorks.


Oh yeah. Big AV fan here. I just couldn't get enough of that guy. Best defensive coach.ever. And DQ. What can I say about his brilliance that he doesn't show off on a nightly basis? Why play the kids on a team going nowhere when you can play Staal every night or Brendan Smith at forward. Nothing I love more than Fast playing 1st and 2nd line. Sorry. I forgot you think Fast is the best player on the team so didn't think he was out of place.
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itsmcilrathtime
Posted 2020-01-11 3:15 AM (#731010 - in reply to #730597)
Subject: RE: Lias Andersson Requests Trade


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Our previous three coaches could do nothing wrong in the eyes of the posters on this board. Renney, Torts and AV. All got fired. All won no cups. All of them had major screwups with young players, and played favorites. Not always putting the best lineup out there. Andersson was 19 year old kid who watched his dumbass coach reward Howden game 1 with more ice time when Lias made him look like crap in the pre-season. That's incompetent coaching. You don't reward poor play from one player and punish another player with good play. Especially when you are talking about a 19 year old. I can see Lias getting away from Quinn and becoming a good NHL player down the line. A lot of the imbeciles in our fan base are trying to credit him with Fox, DeAngelo, Strome, etc.... Credit JD for getting Panarin here because DeAngelo and Strome wouldn't be doing jack sh!t without Panarin here. The best development of young players here has been by JD bringing in Panarin. For all the praise about Hajek, Lindgren, Fox and DeAngelo. This team sucks mooose balls defensively. There isn't very much improvement defensively. Overall, Quinn has done very little to improve the young players here. Panarin has done more to do that in half a season.
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Rranger
Posted 2020-01-11 8:31 AM (#731011 - in reply to #730597)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade


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Its humorous how your opinion is always you against the rest of the board. "" our previous three coaches could do nothing wrong in the eyes of the posters on this board"" Lol sure kid. Now Quinn "'likes"" Howden more than Andersson so he sat the better player Andersson so he could play Howden who he liked better. Lol sure kid. Even though there were multiple other spots in the lineup to insert Andersson it was Coaches love for Howden keeping Andersson from playing. Lol sure kid. Andersson never did much of anything to belong in the NHL ever. He sucked moose balls in your words. And I don't care to know what you were involved in to come up with that gem. We will let your post moose hunt celebration remain your little secret. Andersson is dead wood, always has been. Now his pathetic silence and inference of Ranger abuse has alerted all to his number one weakness, total lack of character, which was supposed to be his number one attribute. The Rangers overrated his character draft day which is a subjective thing and got burnt. Even on draft day there was no attempt to sell fans on his ordinary skill, only his character, of which he"s shown he has none. I suspect Quinn and company picked up on that quickly. I suspect the Lias Andersson NHL career horse has left the barn.
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Steady Eddie
Posted 2020-01-11 8:43 AM (#731012 - in reply to #731010)
Subject: RE: Lias Andersson Requests Trade



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So you're saying Panarin has more to do with DeAngelo's improvement than anyone else?

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Rangerjunkie
Posted 2020-01-11 9:52 AM (#731013 - in reply to #731010)
Subject: RE: Lias Andersson Requests Trade


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itsmcilrathtime - 2020-01-11 3:15 AM

Our previous three coaches could do nothing wrong in the eyes of the posters on this board. Renney, Torts and AV. All got fired. All won no cups. All of them had major screwups with young players, and played favorites. Not always putting the best lineup out there. Andersson was 19 year old kid who watched his dumbass coach reward Howden game 1 with more ice time when Lias made him look like crap in the pre-season. That's incompetent coaching. You don't reward poor play from one player and punish another player with good play. Especially when you are talking about a 19 year old. I can see Lias getting away from Quinn and becoming a good NHL player down the line. A lot of the imbeciles in our fan base are trying to credit him with Fox, DeAngelo, Strome, etc.... Credit JD for getting Panarin here because DeAngelo and Strome wouldn't be doing jack sh!t without Panarin here. The best development of young players here has been by JD bringing in Panarin. For all the praise about Hajek, Lindgren, Fox and DeAngelo. This team sucks mooose balls defensively. There isn't very much improvement defensively. Overall, Quinn has done very little to improve the young players here. Panarin has done more to do that in half a season.


When lias was 19 AV was the coach and Howden wasn't on the team, so............
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Rangerjunkie
Posted 2020-01-11 9:56 AM (#731014 - in reply to #730597)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade


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JG has been trying to trade lias for months, don't you think if he was any good at all some other team would want him?

And now he's refusing to talk to anyone from the Rangers, telling them to talk to his agent?? Another PUNK move!
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PV29
Posted 2020-01-11 5:12 PM (#731018 - in reply to #730597)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade



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On a team where there are a number of young players that are developing and becoming better players (Kakko, D'Angelo, Buchnevic, Howden, Chytil, Fox, Lindgren) and where Shesterkin has been given an opportunity while Henrik (a future Hall of Famer) sits, it's beyond stupid to blame the coach and team and not Andersson here. That doesn't mean that the coach is perfect or does nothing questionable regarding who plays and where. But Andersson has enough in his history to conclude that he's a punk bitch and the team is better off without him. At least for now.
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Rangerjunkie
Posted 2020-01-11 6:58 PM (#731032 - in reply to #730597)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade


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AMEN!!! PV
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Mjolnir
Posted 2020-01-12 7:22 AM (#731086 - in reply to #731018)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade



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PV29 - 2020-01-11 7:12 PM

On a team where there are a number of young players that are developing and becoming better players (Kakko, D'Angelo, Buchnevic, Howden, Chytil, Fox, Lindgren) and where Shesterkin has been given an opportunity while Henrik (a future Hall of Famer) sits, it's beyond stupid to blame the coach and team and not Andersson here. That doesn't mean that the coach is perfect or does nothing questionable regarding who plays and where. But Andersson has enough in his history to conclude that he's a punk bitch and the team is better off without him. At least for now.


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Mjolnir
Posted 2020-01-12 7:23 AM (#731087 - in reply to #731013)
Subject: RE: Lias Andersson Requests Trade



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Rangerjunkie - 2020-01-11 11:52 AM

itsmcilrathtime - 2020-01-11 3:15 AM

Our previous three coaches could do nothing wrong in the eyes of the posters on this board. Renney, Torts and AV. All got fired. All won no cups. All of them had major screwups with young players, and played favorites. Not always putting the best lineup out there. Andersson was 19 year old kid who watched his dumbass coach reward Howden game 1 with more ice time when Lias made him look like crap in the pre-season. That's incompetent coaching. You don't reward poor play from one player and punish another player with good play. Especially when you are talking about a 19 year old. I can see Lias getting away from Quinn and becoming a good NHL player down the line. A lot of the imbeciles in our fan base are trying to credit him with Fox, DeAngelo, Strome, etc.... Credit JD for getting Panarin here because DeAngelo and Strome wouldn't be doing jack sh!t without Panarin here. The best development of young players here has been by JD bringing in Panarin. For all the praise about Hajek, Lindgren, Fox and DeAngelo. This team sucks mooose balls defensively. There isn't very much improvement defensively. Overall, Quinn has done very little to improve the young players here. Panarin has done more to do that in half a season.


When lias was 19 AV was the coach and Howden wasn't on the team, so............

Let's not let facts get in the way of a good argument.
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concust
Posted 2020-01-13 11:00 AM (#731098 - in reply to #730597)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade



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I've defended Andersson in the past and I stand by that - in his first stint with Hartford for example, he was a good forward on a bad team. However, more and more evidence has mounted pointing to a sense of entitlement, and while he's "spoken out" about issues with the teams and organizations, none of this has actually come to light. Usually what happens in these cases is something is leaked (by an agent) to media to set the groundwork and get their side of the story out there. Even that hasn't happened. His second stint in Hartford (this year) was the exact opposite. He became a very disinterested player, on a good team.

There were absolutely times where Andersson should have been given more of a shot/played with better players on the big club. Conversely, he has not made the most of every opportunity he's been given either. And as PV points out, this team is no stranger to playing youngsters in the very early stages of development. So Andersson not playing can either be interpreted as dump wants to (Quinn doesn't "like" Andersson) or more likely, Andersson is not doing something(s) that Quinn needs him to do. Perhaps that thing is buying into a more team philosophy, which Andersson has basically proven that he's unable to do at this point.

So why would Quinn not "like" Andersson? If you're the coach and you have a well-rounded first round pick on a team where there's a long leash and wins don't really matter, why wouldn't he play him? What evidence is there that there's some sort of personal vendetta that Quinn has against Andersson, and Quinn would cut off his nose (bench a good player) to spite his face? This isn't a zero sum game, Andersson's success is the same as Quinn's success, which is the same as the team's success. They all want the same thing, namely, for their prized first round pick to play well, contribute scoring and defense and leadership, and prove all the critics who said Anderssson should not have been drafted in the top 10, wrong. If they all want the same thing, why is only one party paddling in the opposite direction?

That's a rhetorical question of course, the answer based on all available evidence is that dump is wrong and full of sh!t, but we all knew that.
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rjpny75
Posted 2020-01-13 11:16 AM (#731099 - in reply to #731098)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade



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concust - 2020-01-13 1:00 PM

I've defended Andersson in the past and I stand by that - in his first stint with Hartford for example, he was a good forward on a bad team. However, more and more evidence has mounted pointing to a sense of entitlement, and while he's "spoken out" about issues with the teams and organizations, none of this has actually come to light. Usually what happens in these cases is something is leaked (by an agent) to media to set the groundwork and get their side of the story out there. Even that hasn't happened. His second stint in Hartford (this year) was the exact opposite. He became a very disinterested player, on a good team.

There were absolutely times where Andersson should have been given more of a shot/played with better players on the big club. Conversely, he has not made the most of every opportunity he's been given either. And as PV points out, this team is no stranger to playing youngsters in the very early stages of development. So Andersson not playing can either be interpreted as dump wants to (Quinn doesn't "like" Andersson) or more likely, Andersson is not doing something(s) that Quinn needs him to do. Perhaps that thing is buying into a more team philosophy, which Andersson has basically proven that he's unable to do at this point.

So why would Quinn not "like" Andersson? If you're the coach and you have a well-rounded first round pick on a team where there's a long leash and wins don't really matter, why wouldn't he play him? What evidence is there that there's some sort of personal vendetta that Quinn has against Andersson, and Quinn would cut off his nose (bench a good player) to spite his face? This isn't a zero sum game, Andersson's success is the same as Quinn's success, which is the same as the team's success. They all want the same thing, namely, for their prized first round pick to play well, contribute scoring and defense and leadership, and prove all the critics who said Anderssson should not have been drafted in the top 10, wrong. If they all want the same thing, why is only one party paddling in the opposite direction?

That's a rhetorical question of course, the answer based on all available evidence is that dump is wrong and full of sh!t, but we all knew that.


Wait, which one is Dump?
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Rangerjunkie
Posted 2020-01-13 11:27 AM (#731100 - in reply to #731098)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade


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concust - 2020-01-13 11:00 AM

I've defended Andersson in the past and I stand by that - in his first stint with Hartford for example, he was a good forward on a bad team. However, more and more evidence has mounted pointing to a sense of entitlement, and while he's "spoken out" about issues with the teams and organizations, none of this has actually come to light. Usually what happens in these cases is something is leaked (by an agent) to media to set the groundwork and get their side of the story out there. Even that hasn't happened. His second stint in Hartford (this year) was the exact opposite. He became a very disinterested player, on a good team.

There were absolutely times where Andersson should have been given more of a shot/played with better players on the big club. Conversely, he has not made the most of every opportunity he's been given either. And as PV points out, this team is no stranger to playing youngsters in the very early stages of development. So Andersson not playing can either be interpreted as dump wants to (Quinn doesn't "like" Andersson) or more likely, Andersson is not doing something(s) that Quinn needs him to do. Perhaps that thing is buying into a more team philosophy, which Andersson has basically proven that he's unable to do at this point.

So why would Quinn not "like" Andersson? If you're the coach and you have a well-rounded first round pick on a team where there's a long leash and wins don't really matter, why wouldn't he play him? What evidence is there that there's some sort of personal vendetta that Quinn has against Andersson, and Quinn would cut off his nose (bench a good player) to spite his face? This isn't a zero sum game, Andersson's success is the same as Quinn's success, which is the same as the team's success. They all want the same thing, namely, for their prized first round pick to play well, contribute scoring and defense and leadership, and prove all the critics who said Anderssson should not have been drafted in the top 10, wrong. If they all want the same thing, why is only one party paddling in the opposite direction?

That's a rhetorical question of course, the answer based on all available evidence is that dump is wrong and full of sh!t, but we all knew that.


Well said!
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Rangerjunkie
Posted 2020-01-13 11:30 AM (#731101 - in reply to #731099)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade


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rjpny75 - 2020-01-13 11:16 AM

concust - 2020-01-13 1:00 PM

I've defended Andersson in the past and I stand by that - in his first stint with Hartford for example, he was a good forward on a bad team. However, more and more evidence has mounted pointing to a sense of entitlement, and while he's "spoken out" about issues with the teams and organizations, none of this has actually come to light. Usually what happens in these cases is something is leaked (by an agent) to media to set the groundwork and get their side of the story out there. Even that hasn't happened. His second stint in Hartford (this year) was the exact opposite. He became a very disinterested player, on a good team.

There were absolutely times where Andersson should have been given more of a shot/played with better players on the big club. Conversely, he has not made the most of every opportunity he's been given either. And as PV points out, this team is no stranger to playing youngsters in the very early stages of development. So Andersson not playing can either be interpreted as dump wants to (Quinn doesn't "like" Andersson) or more likely, Andersson is not doing something(s) that Quinn needs him to do. Perhaps that thing is buying into a more team philosophy, which Andersson has basically proven that he's unable to do at this point.

So why would Quinn not "like" Andersson? If you're the coach and you have a well-rounded first round pick on a team where there's a long leash and wins don't really matter, why wouldn't he play him? What evidence is there that there's some sort of personal vendetta that Quinn has against Andersson, and Quinn would cut off his nose (bench a good player) to spite his face? This isn't a zero sum game, Andersson's success is the same as Quinn's success, which is the same as the team's success. They all want the same thing, namely, for their prized first round pick to play well, contribute scoring and defense and leadership, and prove all the critics who said Anderssson should not have been drafted in the top 10, wrong. If they all want the same thing, why is only one party paddling in the opposite direction?

That's a rhetorical question of course, the answer based on all available evidence is that dump is wrong and full of sh!t, but we all knew that.


Wait, which one is Dump?


itsmcilrathtime = Dump
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rjpny75
Posted 2020-01-13 1:36 PM (#731103 - in reply to #731101)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade



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itsmcilrathtime = Dump


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Rranger
Posted 2020-01-14 6:52 AM (#731186 - in reply to #730597)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade


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Andersson did not ever show he should have been playing regular in New York. He was infrequently there largely because the Rangers were trying to force feed him hoping he'd come around and save them a little draft reputation.. The pretense Quinn didn't play Andersson because he didn't like him is so stupid its not even worthy of a adult conversation. The argument about Howden is even dumber, Howden proving since day 1 Andersson couldn't carry his skates. Besides that Andersson was never up against Howden He had multiple opportunities to beat out others, Nieves, McKegg, Haley, Smith, Fogarty ect. ect for a spot. He doesn't like the fourth line, fine play your way off it which he did every time. but he played his way off it to Hartford, instead of playing well enough to play on the third line. He's a bonafide, blue diamond, draft day blunder. End of story and a lesson to Clark to quit reaching. It was a **** draft but better safer picks were available. Especially since Andersson's bar is basically ground level.
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rjpny75
Posted 2020-01-14 10:52 AM (#731192 - in reply to #731186)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade



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Rranger - 2020-01-14 8:52 AM

Andersson did not ever show he should have been playing regular in New York. He was infrequently there largely because the Rangers were trying to force feed him hoping he'd come around and save them a little draft reputation.. The pretense Quinn didn't play Andersson because he didn't like him is so stupid its not even worthy of a adult conversation. The argument about Howden is even dumber, Howden proving since day 1 Andersson couldn't carry his skates. Besides that Andersson was never up against Howden He had multiple opportunities to beat out others, Nieves, McKegg, Haley, Smith, Fogarty ect. ect for a spot. He doesn't like the fourth line, fine play your way off it which he did every time. but he played his way off it to Hartford, instead of playing well enough to play on the third line. He's a bonafide, blue diamond, draft day blunder. End of story and a lesson to Clark to quit reaching. It was a **** draft but better safer picks were available. Especially since Andersson's bar is basically ground level.


To Andersson's credit, he did outplay Howden in Pre-Season. Why DQ decided to play Howden over him to begin the season is within the team discussions. I would have liked to see what Lias could do in the same role Howden was assigned to see if Lias' performance during preseason could carry over against NHLer's. I don't think DQ didn't play him because he didn't like him though. I'm sure there were other intangibles at play in the locker room and practice that led to this decision. I cringed when Lias threw that silver medal into the stands and thought right away that one action could be his downfall.

I agree he did nothing during the season on the 4th line that showed he should be moved up. And i don't think he would ever do any better than a 3rd liner in the NHL, skill set wise. But unfortunately his decision to leave has definitely ruined his trade value and probably any chance at an NHL career.

I am curious to hear about some of the details he alluded to but didn't specify in his interview. Pure conjecture on my part, but I think he was still getting Rookie Hazed this season even though he's been with the team since last year.

My guess as to playing injured, bet it was blisters that just didn't heal and they told him to toughen up.
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x10003q
Posted 2020-01-14 11:53 AM (#731193 - in reply to #730597)
Subject: RE: Lias Andersson Requests Trade



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No matter what happens - Andersson walking away is an abject failure on his part. It does not seem like the Rangers had any warning from Andersson. We are a few days past his cryptic bullying and injured feet comments, yet there has been zero other comments from either side. He looked better than Chytil in preseason but he did not build on it during the regular season. He needed to grind out every shift on the 4th line and he did not do that. He looked mostly clueless. Getting sent down to the much upgraded Wolf Pack was the real opportunity to excel - like Chytil did. Instead, he bailed. By bailing he lost what ever value he had due to being a 1st.

Howden has turned out to be the player Andersson should be.
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concust
Posted 2020-01-14 4:10 PM (#731197 - in reply to #730597)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade



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I disagree about Howden, I don't think he's a particularly good forward at this point. Still I'm glad that he's in there over other options like Haley, so it's not much of an issue for me, but overall I've been disappointed in Howden.

Andersson's case is particularly cryptic to me, because I could understand if he came in with the pedigree of a pure-talent scorer, then he has a legitimate beef if he's playing the fourth line with guys like McKegg - if that were the case then no, the coach is not putting you in a position to succeed, and he is not maximizing your talent, by asking a talented scorer to basically play a two way grind game. The mystery is that Andersson's game is basically perfect for this role - be physical when you need to, frustrate defenses, skate well, transition and get some chances the other way. A fourth line role, while yes, surpressing his offensive output, is still the perfect role for someone with his advertised skill set. In fact, I watched the guy in Hartford his first pro year and he pretty much played this role to perfection. But he refused to do it, or do it well, in NY. Make no mistake, it should have been easy for him to simply nail down that fourth line role, score 15 points his first real full NHL year, play a two way game. But he never took to the role.

Andersson actually did a lot of things right in his tenure here, and many times, he was as I expected and advertised, except for at the NHL level. I don't doubt that it would have come with time, but he seemed to think he was two years farther along in his development, than everyone else thought.
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Rranger
Posted 2020-01-14 6:45 PM (#731199 - in reply to #731192)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade


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rjpny75 - 2020-01-14 9:52 AM

Rranger - 2020-01-14 8:52 AM

Andersson did not ever show he should have been playing regular in New York. He was infrequently there largely because the Rangers were trying to force feed him hoping he'd come around and save them a little draft reputation.. The pretense Quinn didn't play Andersson because he didn't like him is so stupid its not even worthy of a adult conversation. The argument about Howden is even dumber, Howden proving since day 1 Andersson couldn't carry his skates. Besides that Andersson was never up against Howden He had multiple opportunities to beat out others, Nieves, McKegg, Haley, Smith, Fogarty ect. ect for a spot. He doesn't like the fourth line, fine play your way off it which he did every time. but he played his way off it to Hartford, instead of playing well enough to play on the third line. He's a bonafide, blue diamond, draft day blunder. End of story and a lesson to Clark to quit reaching. It was a **** draft but better safer picks were available. Especially since Andersson's bar is basically ground level.


To Andersson's credit, he did outplay Howden in Pre-Season. Why DQ decided to play Howden over him to begin the season is within the team discussions. I would have liked to see what Lias could do in the same role Howden was assigned to see if Lias' performance during preseason could carry over against NHLer's. I don't think DQ didn't play him because he didn't like him though. I'm sure there were other intangibles at play in the locker room and practice that led to this decision. I cringed when Lias threw that silver medal into the stands and thought right away that one action could be his downfall.

I agree he did nothing during the season on the 4th line that showed he should be moved up. And i don't think he would ever do any better than a 3rd liner in the NHL, skill set wise. But unfortunately his decision to leave has definitely ruined his trade value and probably any chance at an NHL career.

I am curious to hear about some of the details he alluded to but didn't specify in his interview. Pure conjecture on my part, but I think he was still getting Rookie Hazed this season even though he's been with the team since last year.

My guess as to playing injured, bet it was blisters that just didn't heal and they told him to toughen up.




Your opinion Andersson outplayed Howden is noted and 100% disagreed with. Pistols at 40 paces?
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rjpny75
Posted 2020-01-15 6:52 AM (#731205 - in reply to #731199)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade



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Rranger - 2020-01-14 8:45 PM

rjpny75 - 2020-01-14 9:52 AM

Rranger - 2020-01-14 8:52 AM

Andersson did not ever show he should have been playing regular in New York. He was infrequently there largely because the Rangers were trying to force feed him hoping he'd come around and save them a little draft reputation.. The pretense Quinn didn't play Andersson because he didn't like him is so stupid its not even worthy of a adult conversation. The argument about Howden is even dumber, Howden proving since day 1 Andersson couldn't carry his skates. Besides that Andersson was never up against Howden He had multiple opportunities to beat out others, Nieves, McKegg, Haley, Smith, Fogarty ect. ect for a spot. He doesn't like the fourth line, fine play your way off it which he did every time. but he played his way off it to Hartford, instead of playing well enough to play on the third line. He's a bonafide, blue diamond, draft day blunder. End of story and a lesson to Clark to quit reaching. It was a **** draft but better safer picks were available. Especially since Andersson's bar is basically ground level.


To Andersson's credit, he did outplay Howden in Pre-Season. Why DQ decided to play Howden over him to begin the season is within the team discussions. I would have liked to see what Lias could do in the same role Howden was assigned to see if Lias' performance during preseason could carry over against NHLer's. I don't think DQ didn't play him because he didn't like him though. I'm sure there were other intangibles at play in the locker room and practice that led to this decision. I cringed when Lias threw that silver medal into the stands and thought right away that one action could be his downfall.

I agree he did nothing during the season on the 4th line that showed he should be moved up. And i don't think he would ever do any better than a 3rd liner in the NHL, skill set wise. But unfortunately his decision to leave has definitely ruined his trade value and probably any chance at an NHL career.

I am curious to hear about some of the details he alluded to but didn't specify in his interview. Pure conjecture on my part, but I think he was still getting Rookie Hazed this season even though he's been with the team since last year.

My guess as to playing injured, bet it was blisters that just didn't heal and they told him to toughen up.




Your opinion Andersson outplayed Howden is noted and 100% disagreed with. Pistols at 40 paces?


So we're clear, I said he outplayed Howden in Pre-season. Once the season started, the other way around.
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Rranger
Posted 2020-01-15 7:13 AM (#731206 - in reply to #731205)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade


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rjpny75 - 2020-01-15 5:52 AM

Rranger - 2020-01-14 8:45 PM

rjpny75 - 2020-01-14 9:52 AM

Rranger - 2020-01-14 8:52 AM

Andersson did not ever show he should have been playing regular in New York. He was infrequently there largely because the Rangers were trying to force feed him hoping he'd come around and save them a little draft reputation.. The pretense Quinn didn't play Andersson because he didn't like him is so stupid its not even worthy of a adult conversation. The argument about Howden is even dumber, Howden proving since day 1 Andersson couldn't carry his skates. Besides that Andersson was never up against Howden He had multiple opportunities to beat out others, Nieves, McKegg, Haley, Smith, Fogarty ect. ect for a spot. He doesn't like the fourth line, fine play your way off it which he did every time. but he played his way off it to Hartford, instead of playing well enough to play on the third line. He's a bonafide, blue diamond, draft day blunder. End of story and a lesson to Clark to quit reaching. It was a **** draft but better safer picks were available. Especially since Andersson's bar is basically ground level.


To Andersson's credit, he did outplay Howden in Pre-Season. Why DQ decided to play Howden over him to begin the season is within the team discussions. I would have liked to see what Lias could do in the same role Howden was assigned to see if Lias' performance during preseason could carry over against NHLer's. I don't think DQ didn't play him because he didn't like him though. I'm sure there were other intangibles at play in the locker room and practice that led to this decision. I cringed when Lias threw that silver medal into the stands and thought right away that one action could be his downfall.

I agree he did nothing during the season on the 4th line that showed he should be moved up. And i don't think he would ever do any better than a 3rd liner in the NHL, skill set wise. But unfortunately his decision to leave has definitely ruined his trade value and probably any chance at an NHL career.

I am curious to hear about some of the details he alluded to but didn't specify in his interview. Pure conjecture on my part, but I think he was still getting Rookie Hazed this season even though he's been with the team since last year.

My guess as to playing injured, bet it was blisters that just didn't heal and they told him to toughen up.




Your opinion Andersson outplayed Howden is noted and 100% disagreed with. Pistols at 40 paces?


So we're clear, I said he outplayed Howden in Pre-season. Once the season started, the other way around.




I still disagree, Andersson's preseason was more wishfull thinking of posters and coaches wanting to see Andersson succeed than reality. I didn't see Andersson outplaying Howden, and apparently neither did the coaches who never budged him off the fourth line. His presence on the team was more likely the result of a management decision to let him try to stick. McKegg, Nieves and Fogarty would have been a more effective fourth line center than Andersson. He has never been able to physically battle and compete one on one. He was a pushover. Howden can and does effectively compete one on one. Last season his rookie year Howden had the same number of points as Chytil and played less games, and never saw a power play unlike Chytil.. This year he's right behind Chytil Kakko, and Lemieux in points with again way less opportunity. But yet Howden isn't doing anything and Andersson should replace him. The kid gets no respect, all he does is his job and play very well defensively. Now Quinn has some mojo going with Howden, Kappo and Chytil and Howden is doing his part.
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sureshore
Posted 2020-01-15 8:39 AM (#731208 - in reply to #731206)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade


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Rranger - 2020-01-15 9:13 AM

rjpny75 - 2020-01-15 5:52 AM

Rranger - 2020-01-14 8:45 PM

rjpny75 - 2020-01-14 9:52 AM

Rranger - 2020-01-14 8:52 AM

Andersson did not ever show he should have been playing regular in New York. He was infrequently there largely because the Rangers were trying to force feed him hoping he'd come around and save them a little draft reputation.. The pretense Quinn didn't play Andersson because he didn't like him is so stupid its not even worthy of a adult conversation. The argument about Howden is even dumber, Howden proving since day 1 Andersson couldn't carry his skates. Besides that Andersson was never up against Howden He had multiple opportunities to beat out others, Nieves, McKegg, Haley, Smith, Fogarty ect. ect for a spot. He doesn't like the fourth line, fine play your way off it which he did every time. but he played his way off it to Hartford, instead of playing well enough to play on the third line. He's a bonafide, blue diamond, draft day blunder. End of story and a lesson to Clark to quit reaching. It was a **** draft but better safer picks were available. Especially since Andersson's bar is basically ground level.


To Andersson's credit, he did outplay Howden in Pre-Season. Why DQ decided to play Howden over him to begin the season is within the team discussions. I would have liked to see what Lias could do in the same role Howden was assigned to see if Lias' performance during preseason could carry over against NHLer's. I don't think DQ didn't play him because he didn't like him though. I'm sure there were other intangibles at play in the locker room and practice that led to this decision. I cringed when Lias threw that silver medal into the stands and thought right away that one action could be his downfall.

I agree he did nothing during the season on the 4th line that showed he should be moved up. And i don't think he would ever do any better than a 3rd liner in the NHL, skill set wise. But unfortunately his decision to leave has definitely ruined his trade value and probably any chance at an NHL career.

I am curious to hear about some of the details he alluded to but didn't specify in his interview. Pure conjecture on my part, but I think he was still getting Rookie Hazed this season even though he's been with the team since last year.

My guess as to playing injured, bet it was blisters that just didn't heal and they told him to toughen up.




Your opinion Andersson outplayed Howden is noted and 100% disagreed with. Pistols at 40 paces?


So we're clear, I said he outplayed Howden in Pre-season. Once the season started, the other way around.




I still disagree, Andersson's preseason was more wishfull thinking of posters and coaches wanting to see Andersson succeed than reality. I didn't see Andersson outplaying Howden, and apparently neither did the coaches who never budged him off the fourth line. His presence on the team was more likely the result of a management decision to let him try to stick. McKegg, Nieves and Fogarty would have been a more effective fourth line center than Andersson. He has never been able to physically battle and compete one on one. He was a pushover. Howden can and does effectively compete one on one. Last season his rookie year Howden had the same number of points as Chytil and played less games, and never saw a power play unlike Chytil.. This year he's right behind Chytil Kakko, and Lemieux in points with again way less opportunity. But yet Howden isn't doing anything and Andersson should replace him. The kid gets no respect, all he does is his job and play very well defensively. Now Quinn has some mojo going with Howden, Kappo and Chytil and Howden is doing his part.


I'd agree with RJPNY and the 'wishful thinkers and coaches' - Andersson did outplay Howden in pre-season. You seem to be in the minority on this one. You are also in the minority if you think Howden plays 'very well defensively'. Defense is his biggest weakness at this point - metrics would bear this out as well.

All that being said, Andersson, once given the 4th line assignment needed to work his ass off to earn more and he didn't exactly do that. Granted, playing with Haley and Smith is no joy to any player, especially one who was a #7 overall but he needed to prove the coaches wrong to change that - didn't happen.

I'm done with Andersson as many were before I was, but let's not delude ourselves about Howden's skillset or ceiling. He'd be a nice throw-in to all the trades that get proposed on here.
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Rranger
Posted 2020-01-15 9:19 AM (#731211 - in reply to #730597)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade


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Lol. In the minority because I disagree with you and RJPNY sure. Small samples like that skew stats and metrics. Which you are welcome to show me about Howden. Maybe you think Howden doesn’t play well defensively but Quinn does, he’s not scared to use him, and has spoken many times how well he fulfills his defensive responsibilities. I don’t remember him ever talking about Andersson’s defence positively.
There is no delusion about anything, no one has said Howden is untouchable or has a top end ceiling except you. That was never part of any of the above discussion til you brought it up. The discussion was pretty simple Howden or Andersson, and Andersson’s inability to beat out anyone on what is a piss poor fourth line.
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Rangerjunkie
Posted 2020-01-15 10:28 AM (#731212 - in reply to #730597)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade


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One clear difference between Howden and Anderson is attitude. I think both probably could max out as a 3rd line center.(before Anderson pulled this latest stunt anyway)

I'm glad to be done with Anderson. Howden needs to bulk up a little more and be more physical, win those one on one battles and grow into that 3rd line center position.

DQ clearly trusted Howden more than Anderson. Maybe the attitudes have something to do with that?
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PV29
Posted 2020-01-15 10:57 AM (#731213 - in reply to #731212)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade



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I think the upside to Howden is better than what many believe. The move to wing has been good for him. He doesn't have the tools to be an effective center in the NHL, and the line with Howden, Chytil and Kakko has been consistently effective. That may be due in large part to Chytil's play of late, but the young wingers have been good as well. Physically I'd like to see Howden add some strength and power to his game. He has a big frame but not the skill set to be a finesse player, so he needs to commit more to grinding and playing hard along the boards and in front of the net.

I agree that his attitude is such that he'll do whatever the coaches ask of him. He's centered the 4th line and moved to wing when Chytil emerged as the better option at center. This may be the deciding factor with regard to Howden vs. Andersson; one did what was asked while the other pouted or complained. Pure speculation on my part but it wouldn't surprise me if that was the case.
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concust
Posted 2020-01-15 3:00 PM (#731220 - in reply to #730597)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade



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For the record,

Andersson outplayed Howden in preseason 2018. Andersson started out stronger, and finished the preseason kind of meh. Howden was the opposite, and the late push seemed to cement the decision to go with Howden out of the gate, vs Andersson.

Howden then had a hot start, scoring some points until about Thanksgiving, at which point he cooled off and that year from Thanksgiving on, Howden was actually one of the poorest performing forwards in the league. Metrics do point to this, I'd be surprised if you could find any metrics that back up your claim that he was any good defensively. But I have an open mind and you're welcome to post them - 60 games is no longer "small sample size" so that should be a pretty good basis to make a claim, about a season.

Andersson went to Hartford and for the most part, he did the work. He didn't light up the team or the league, but it was a very bad team. He played in all situations and it looked very much like he was being developed the traditional way you develop a two way forward, with tons of ice time and loads of responsibility. He rarely faltered although it was clear he did not have top end offensive skill even at the AHL level (the difference in offensive IQ between him and Lettieri was obvious)

Since then... nothing much more needs to be said. Howden, although all the results aren't there, is likely proving to be coachable, which is why he sticks. That may be an investment that pays off down the road, and why Quinn sticks with him. As I've said in a previous post, I don't disagree with the idea that you stick with a kid if you see potential in him. I do not complain about Howden, because even if he makes a ton of mistakes, you'd rather invest that time in a kid than a Beleskey or a Haley or a Ryane Clowe. I've preached this for years, and I'm fine with it.

I don't think the blame for the Andersson situation rests solely on one party or the other. It's not a case of "Quinn surpressing his opportunity" or "Andersson is an entitled brat". IMO the truth is somewhere in the middle - there were times where Andersson should have gotten more of an opportunity than he did, and should have been tried playing with more talent - but he also failed to make the most of the opportunities that he did have. If you are in the NHL as a 19 year old and on the fourth line with crappy linemates, at least be a shutdown center. At least finish your checks. At least look interested. All too often his attitude presented itself not as "competitive fire" but as entitlement. Can he channel that attitude better and use it to his advantage in the future? Who knows. If he can't, his NHL career is over before it began.

The thing that guys like Andersson don't seem to fully realize is that there's a draft every year and new shiny toys with more potential than you, get added to the organization constantly. It's great that you were a top 10 pick, but now 3 years out, what good did that really do you? It took Shesterkin proving himself getting better and better for 5 years before he even played an NHL game.

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Rranger
Posted 2020-01-15 5:57 PM (#731222 - in reply to #730597)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade


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Andersson outplayed Howden at the start of training camp, again is your opinion. Even if I give you that, it’s because teams were playing scrubs and Andersson was getting the full meal opportunity early in camp. When the going got tougher as camp wound down Andersson was nowhere and Howden got better.
The “small sample size” refers to Rpjny and sureshore’s opinion. I guess you whiffed on that one. All one has to understand about Howden is Quinn has trust in him and uses him regular since he broke in. He’s not an idiot if he had better he’d be playing the better player. At the end of all the short stories, Howden is better than Andersson. End of story.
Howden had a good first 1/2 last year and hit a wall, big deal happens all the time with kids. He played hard as he worked his way through it. This year he is a big 5 points behind Chytil and trails Lemieux and Kappo by less yet all he gets is grief on here about his offence. Chytil has played less games but he has also had more opportunity. This is not about Howden being anything more than what he is, a young guy making a nice contribution especially now with Kappo, and Chytil. Getting a ****pile of grief on here because as a second year player he’s not lighting it up. Some people need to understand there is a lot more to a successful hockey player than just scoring. Howden does a lot of little things right, things coaches like to see done right. Or he wouldn’t be playing. No mystery here.

Edited by Rranger 2020-01-15 9:52 PM
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itsmcilrathtime
Posted 2020-01-16 2:40 AM (#731223 - in reply to #730597)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade


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If you didn't think Andersson outplayed Howden in the pre-season you haven't got a fukkkking clue what you are watching in hockey games. He made Howden look like crap. Howden has done nothing all season. Now that he's on the 4th line, I dont' expect him to with the scrubs he plays with. However, he got 3rd line time and sucked azzzz. Your opinion on Andersson means little. You aren't objective at all and your a huge hypocrite. You suck Fox off who was a bigger dickhead that Andersson was. He told Carolina he only wanted to play for the Rangers, thus taking away all their leverage and you do nothing but bend over for him.
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Rranger
Posted 2020-01-16 6:15 AM (#731225 - in reply to #730597)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade


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The guy who is still sucking moose balls, thinks Andersson, who had a couple early decent exhibition games against scrubs and then faded when the men showed up, had a better training camp than Howden. . He also rants about Fox in a comparable with Andersson which is supposed to be noteworthy and I assume important to the conversation. Fabulous enlightening input. Again Andersson borders on a Ranger draft blunder in so many ways, overestimating so many parts of his mental and physical makeup. The Rangers rely as lot on Bobrov over in Europe and he's probably the guy with the most input on Andersson and Kravstov.

Edited by Rranger 2020-01-16 6:17 AM
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robstones
Posted 2020-01-16 6:43 AM (#731226 - in reply to #731225)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade



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Anderson is going through the same thought process that Kravtsov was.... is.... an immature impatience to work their way through the system, and earn NHL ice. They think they're done developing. And so if they're not in the best league getting maximum minutes, it's wrong.

They're so use to being hot ****..... they're not use to being in a league where everyone is hot ****.

That said, both players are top 9 talent.... they just need to get their heads on straight
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Rranger
Posted 2020-01-16 6:58 AM (#731227 - in reply to #730597)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade


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Andersson is not top nine talent unless its in sweden.
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Mjolnir
Posted 2020-01-16 7:24 AM (#731228 - in reply to #731220)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade



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concust - 2020-01-15 5:00 PM

For the record,

Andersson outplayed Howden in preseason 2018. Andersson started out stronger, and finished the preseason kind of meh. Howden was the opposite, and the late push seemed to cement the decision to go with Howden out of the gate, vs Andersson.

Howden then had a hot start, scoring some points until about Thanksgiving, at which point he cooled off and that year from Thanksgiving on, Howden was actually one of the poorest performing forwards in the league. Metrics do point to this, I'd be surprised if you could find any metrics that back up your claim that he was any good defensively. But I have an open mind and you're welcome to post them - 60 games is no longer "small sample size" so that should be a pretty good basis to make a claim, about a season.

Andersson went to Hartford and for the most part, he did the work. He didn't light up the team or the league, but it was a very bad team. He played in all situations and it looked very much like he was being developed the traditional way you develop a two way forward, with tons of ice time and loads of responsibility. He rarely faltered although it was clear he did not have top end offensive skill even at the AHL level (the difference in offensive IQ between him and Lettieri was obvious)

Since then... nothing much more needs to be said. Howden, although all the results aren't there, is likely proving to be coachable, which is why he sticks. That may be an investment that pays off down the road, and why Quinn sticks with him. As I've said in a previous post, I don't disagree with the idea that you stick with a kid if you see potential in him. I do not complain about Howden, because even if he makes a ton of mistakes, you'd rather invest that time in a kid than a Beleskey or a Haley or a Ryane Clowe. I've preached this for years, and I'm fine with it.

I don't think the blame for the Andersson situation rests solely on one party or the other. It's not a case of "Quinn surpressing his opportunity" or "Andersson is an entitled brat". IMO the truth is somewhere in the middle - there were times where Andersson should have gotten more of an opportunity than he did, and should have been tried playing with more talent - but he also failed to make the most of the opportunities that he did have. If you are in the NHL as a 19 year old and on the fourth line with crappy linemates, at least be a shutdown center. At least finish your checks. At least look interested. All too often his attitude presented itself not as "competitive fire" but as entitlement. Can he channel that attitude better and use it to his advantage in the future? Who knows. If he can't, his NHL career is over before it began.

The thing that guys like Andersson don't seem to fully realize is that there's a draft every year and new shiny toys with more potential than you, get added to the organization constantly. It's great that you were a top 10 pick, but now 3 years out, what good did that really do you? It took Shesterkin proving himself getting better and better for 5 years before he even played an NHL game.

If I recall correctly, Howden suffered an injury that kept him out of the lineup over 2 months. He was never the same afterwards.
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Rranger
Posted 2020-01-16 7:34 AM (#731229 - in reply to #730597)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade


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I watched andersson since day one hoping he would be a good player for the Rangers like all Ranger fans, even after objecting to his draft position. He was a supposed character player who went to the net hard. Which he does against kids. When he goes up against NHL players when he tried his gloves in the face crap and crease scrums he got fed his lunch. No fights just reciprocating cross checks, slashes and glove shots to his head. He took it for about three games and his net crashing stopped and mr character became mr perimeter where his weak overall skill set can't survive. So either he grows a set and starts playing the game the Rangers drafted or he's toast. I also think based on his lineage in Sweden he's been cakewalked through the Swedish hockey system never facing a moments adversity til New York. No wonder Mr entitlement is spewing hints of impropriety. Davidson says you never close doors but this one is slammed shut, Anderson will be on the first decent trade out of New York assuming there is one.
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sureshore
Posted 2020-01-16 12:36 PM (#731230 - in reply to #731228)
Subject: Re: Lias Andersson Requests Trade


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Mjolnir - 2020-01-16 9:24 AM



If I recall correctly, Howden suffered an injury that kept him out of the lineup over 2 months. He was never the same afterwards.


Howden missed one month (February) and ironically he was better in March (7 points) than he was in Dec (1 assist) or January (1 assist).
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